Pale Blue Dot (an atheist's view - tiny update)
Created on: September 27th, 2006
Damn that's a lot of comments. I've responded at http://skeptobot.blogspot.com - but that is just a quick rant. I will put a more professional post there later. It also has the picture & quote in full.
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Sieglove... that's just it. Nowhere does Lave tell us to share his views. Whestone doesn't come out and say "become cristin or ur gin 2 hell!!!1" either, but he uses a technique I like to call the "fire-and-brimstone play" to scare people into believing it anyway. Lave doesn't try to convert us. That is nowhere in his mind. Whestone, however... the very title make it clear. To him, all who do not share his faith are infidels.
I'm rather tired of having ANY religious ideals foisted upon me at a comedy site. I don't feel that whetstone's sites or this one have a place among a site embodied by sites chock full of pedophiles, dancing germans, raves, proclamations of the fact it is "The Best Day Ever," or Sean Connery telling me i'm the man now. But like so many others here, my two cents is worth far less than that to the average trawler.
Speaking of Whetstone, I sent him a message about his God YTMND and he replied by sending me a link to a YTMND basically telling me I'm going to hell...I hope he's not trying to scare me into believing (very popular tactic in religion) but I'm not going to be intimidated by a concept I don't believe in lol
I myself am a pretty serious Catholic. I do, however, respect the opinions of others. I have no grudge against people with different beliefs as long as they don't have one against me. On the other hand, I have never seen this before and I think that it gives a very deep message that I think everyone should learn from. Well done.
i agree you can think outside yourself and this planet but the fact of the matter is every night sagan goes to bed with his wife. down here. i have heard alot of creation stories but here is my favorite and i think the most ridiculous one. "The universe is constantly expanding and will continue to until it collapses destroying us all. And we are all here, just cuz. No reason. Total accident, unfathomable odds were beat" if thats possible then why is a higher power not?
interesting and definately humbling reminder of how huge the universe is.
amazing that God would make all that for us to marvel at. blows my mind.
http://atinyglimpse.ytmnd.com/
^^I like this one a lot more^^
but i give you some credit. I also don't see the connection between whetstone and your point.
Even though I'm a Mormon/Christian, I've gotta say that out of all of these YTMNDs coming out of the "Whetstone War," this one is the best. To me, this one has been the one to really put it all into perspective the best, and it all makes sense. More than anything, I see it as a rallying cry for peace; regardless of what you believe in, you share this teensy little speck of a dot riding on a sunbeam with 6 billion other people.
I'm also gonna say that, to me at least, it makes no sense if a Christian God, who is supposed to be perfectly loving and perfectly just, automatically condems people to Hell if they didn't accept Chrstianity in this life, regardless of how good they were anyways. A real Christian can recognize the fact that there are good people everywhere, regardless of what they do or do not believe in. We need to be saying "How can I add to the good?" instead of "You're wrong."
-Yeah, I guess You're right, evey event in the history of mankind was completely insignificant, and, the truth is...its completely hopeless,
we can't get saved from ourselves.
- Too bad you made this to make youself feel important Mr. Freethinker. I really hate to break it to you, but this YTMND, your life, and my life are all insignificant, no matter how cool you feel about being 'up and coming'.
Bear with me folks, heres a quote by Nietzche: "Where has God gone?" he cried. "I shall tell you. We have killed him - you and I. We are his murderers. But how have we done this? How were we able to drink up the sea? Who gave us the sponge to wipe away the entire horizon? What did we do when we unchained the earth from its sun? Whither is it moving now? Whither are we moving now? Away from all suns? Are we not perpetually falling? Backward, sideward, forward, in all directions? Is there any up or down left
Are we not straying as through an infinite nothing? Do we not feel the breath of empty space? Has it not become colder? Is it not more and more night coming on all the time? Must not lanterns be lit in the morning? Do we not hear anything yet of the noise of the gravediggers who are burying God? Do we not smell anything yet of God's decomposition? Gods too decompose. God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we, murderers of all murderers, console ourselves? That which was the holies
and mightiest of all that the world has yet possessed has bled to death under our knives. Who will wipe this blood off us? With what water could we purify ourselves? What festivals of atonement, what sacred games shall we need to invent? Is not the greatness of this deed too great for us? Must we not ourselves become gods simply to be worthy of it? There has never been a greater deed; and whosoever shall be born after us - for the sake of this deed he shall be part of a higher history than all history
hitherto?" What Nietzche is saying isnt that we have litterally killed God, what he is saying is that in our infancy we created God to answer the questions we could not comprehend and that filled us with fear. However our species has reached adolescence and WE NO LONGER NEED TO INVOKE GOD TO JUSTIFY ANYTHING! Any natural phenomenon was "God" before and science has provided and answer to so many questions that we can assume future advancements will continue to give us the answer. The time has come for
humanity to throw off the shackles of the overbearing father figure WE INVENTED to keep ourself warm at night. The lack of existance of God does not make our lives meaningless, rather it means it is time for us to decide what makes our live meaningful FOR OURSELVES. Humanity is created God, God served its purpose, coddled us in our infancy but now has been rendered obsolete, its time to retire the idea. Im done.
The arrogance of you atheists amuses and disgusts me. 1'd for calling religious people "small-minded" and "quaint," and 1'd for stupid atheist arrogance. When your life ends, and you stand before the God who created everything, THEN you'll see who was right. Hopefully for you, though, you'll figure out the blatant truth before then; I sincerely hope so.
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one time, i started pulling on my nipples and the yellow milk came out. then my fat neighbor came over and started drinking from my nipple. i was all like "hey, what the f*ck?" and he was like "oh noes, the milk has stopped coming out." so i stabbed him and went on the internets. i saw this thingy about a blue dot, i was all like "what the f*ck?" then i watched this worthless piece of sh*t, it was boring as sh*t. you were all like "omfg!! we are very very small...so there is no god!" MY SITES ARE BETTER.
Hey, timepants. Guess what? Before you go questioning a religion's God, you'd better know what your talking about. First off, God doesn't condemn people to hell. You and the devil accomplish that. So if you end up there, it's really your own fault.
And if you're not Christian? Hey, I respect your religion, and I'm not going to force mine upon you. Live and let live. I'm just telling you what Christians believe.
We're are on this planet alone with no divine assistance or guidance. Millions of miles away from the nearest habital planet, all we have is our own little pale blue dot. Ours. Not gods. Wouldn't is be more productive to believe in your fellow man rather then some religous zealots? I may be a misanthrope, but the idea of human loving humans, rather then humans loving humans for loving the same invisible friend, is a much better idea.
I like to think the Roman Empire would have had some cosmic significance if it had survived until today. You know, maybe Alpha Centauri would already be a part of the Empire by now & what not. (perhaps even Galactic Empire vs. Roman Empire!?! =O) We'd have about 1500 extra years of progress to make without the Dark Ages resetting everything. Rome would definitely be far beyond space worthy by now. Then again, a bunch of barbarians overthrew them in the end... You never know.
it seems too many defensive religious people are missing the god damned point of it above all. Rather then looking at whats being said LOOKING AT THE WORDS AND COMPREHENDING all they are seeing is "God doesent exsist blah blah." God GAVE you a mind to reason and worry about more important things then territory and having your personal belifs validated in some kangeroo argument ON THE INTERNET. DAMMIT TO HELL did you READ anything in that besides a tagline..
No wait I aint finished. IF you got anything from that besides "god doesent exsist" THEN IT IS YOU WHO ARE BLESSED in the eyes of the lord. For gods sake look at the bigger picture? LOOK AT HOW MUCH EFFORT REGAURDLESS OF BELIEF IN GOD IT TAKES TO MAKE YOUR BROTHERS ON THIS WORLD worth MORE then a PIECE of LAND and SUM of MONEY or a POINT of VIEW.. Athiests DO GOOD WORK and the whole hell alot of you that poo poo this have only mouseclicks to show for your impact on this world.
I agree with what's being said here, but the way it's presented is fairly insulting. Mainly, it acts as a public statement to educate everyone on why our world and the idea of god are of almost no influence to the universe as a whole - but who is this aimed at? You say a few times 'we athiests' as if this is your intended audience, but then go on to just vehemently agree with similar statments from similar people. It's clear you're going against organized religion, but taking the stance of discussion among
st peers, which is a far easier argument stance to take - there is no counter-statement to anything you say if its a discussion among like-minded folks. This rather trivalizes the unbiased feel that (agnostics at least) and science-based athiests stand for by using a rather simple technique to avoid any argument to statments. BTW sound is major queer, the beeping is full of f*ggots.
No matter what you are, Animal, Human, we all end up exhausting ourselves the same way, we simply die, and turn to dust
I've come to terms with that, the Things Christians try so desperately to avoid, heck i tried to avoid it
Its easier to lie to yourself and say theres something else... but thats not true
I might be happier if i could trick myself into thinking theres heaven
but Im atheist because thats What I honestly beleive in 100% I had doubts when i was christian, but I have none now
Okay, I'm sorry, I just gotta say something. This whole religious war on here is just ridiculous. I'm not going to state what I believe, for fear of getting flamed by either side, but I mean, come ON. Look at yourselves. There is no way within the realms of science and religion to factually prove or disprove the existence of a God. No matter how many facts either side presents, there will always be a way around it. It all depends on what YOU personally believe.
But as for the site itself, I actually think it's pretty good. That's an awesome quote, really makes you think. Then again, I wouldn't care if an athiest, catholic, muslim, sea horse, or door knob said it. It just shows a sign of a good thinker, and there are plenty of great thinkers of various creeds.
What upsets me is the people who watched this, and failed to grasp what was said, or what they saw. Moreso are the people too blinded by their faith to realize that god is not going to make us stop killing each other. He gave us free will, and with that free will, we craft weapons and plot to use them on one another, and for what? For power? For money? Because one religion calls their god Allah and the other simply God? What difference does it make in the end, if there's an afterlife, or if we cease to be?
I'm amazed by down voters here. They are precisely what you were talking about. Small minded. They expect you to go against what he said, which is so wrong on so many levels it's hard to figure out where to start. The "Right" is trying make inductive reasoning out of something that must and has to be deductive. BTW, inductive reasoning is the way children use logic, yes I'm calling you childish.
Life doesn't need God to exist. Life exists because it has the potential to, the chance to self-organize and emerge from a medium that can support it. Believing in a God is the equivalent of giving in to natural human insecurity, instead of coming to terms with it, realising thatwe don't need a heavenly guide; we simply live, and that is all that we need. For with life comes the potential to forge our own futures, create purpose for ourselves.
Existence is our sandbox, our easel to paint on.
5 for opening up a debate (rational at...well at least at SOME levels) and opening up communication between believers and nonbelievers alike. I find it strange that both sides are so eager to argue and so reluctant to listen. Both atheist and Christian alike may learn from this picture, for in the end is not every arguement totally relative to perception? As for myself, I don't want to be a Christian, I'm perfectly content to believe in Christ.
to say religion is small minded almost makes me want to 1 star you. I am religious, yet you put me in the same place as someone else and demean us though ive done nothing to you, In a way if i was black you just called me a n*gg*r. Because one person made you mad your gunna call all of us small minded? thats ironic
BUT i did enjoy this YTMND as that is one of my favorite writeings of Mr Sagan. 4'd
wow, just listen to yourselves......he wasnt saying god isnt out there......you guys totally missed that he was saying we can argue about religion and petty sh*t like this all we want, but it doesnt change the fact that we have to live on this tiney planet with each other and we have to learn to settle our differences. quoting Carl Sagan is masterful in its own sense.
You get two stars for using a Sagan quote, but the YTMND itself is long and pretty dull. Also, as a general critique that's certainly not directed solely at you - YTMND shouldn't be used as a blog or message board post. I miss when people on this site were just trying to make other people laugh instead of contributing to the vast chasm of pointless debate (overflowing with logical fallacies) that's so prevalent on the internet these days. And, yes, I'm an atheist myself.
I consider myself Catholic and was in no way offended by this site. On the contrary, I thought it was incredibly thought provoking. I'm disappointed to see how a good deal of Christians reacted to this YTMND, with small minded threats and accusations, not even taking time to consider the points the quote was posing. Everything that he said was true. Whether we like it or not, we're in this together and we better start acting like it if we feel like surving much longer. The universe existed before us
Outstanding, Carl Sagan once said "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." I don't think a self affirming 2000 yr old book counts as extraordinary evidence. That being said, we as agnostics and atheists cannot disprove their god.. so why try to change their mind? The path to being a skeptic is one that you walk alone, it is something that you yourself must come to terms with. Presented with the evidence, you can either belive it, or you can choose not to. In the past, this was not the case.
I believe too if your mind is not clouded with the boundaries of religion, you are able to open your mind to learn more and accept more in and about the world. all i've learned from reigion is those who follow their beliefs in god are the first ones to judge and hate and let it stew in their minds like soured milk left out in the hot sun.
Anubis, to say we only know .1% of knowledge in the universe doesnt make any sense. To say that would be saying that "Knowledge" is a finite and tangible object. Under that assumption.. as humans grow and learn.. do we lessen god? We are always pulling from that pool of 100% knowledge.. I do not think that is the case. Our ignorance is not proof of the exsistance of a god or greater power. To our ancestors.. modern man would appear to be gods, but we know that not to be true.
This is an absolutely stunning Ytmnd. Unlike some people, I have no problem with you and milions of others being atheists, I support you having the freedom of choice, it' what makes America great. Narrow-minded people like Whetstone gives us Christians a bad name, so I think i speak for the majority of the Christians out there when I say this: Sorry. I personally think we need accept people for WHO they are, not WHAT they are. Let's stop fighting, people.
It'll never cease to amaze me how fervently people will defend something they BELIEVE....when there is absolutely no proof for it. It's sad to see just how many stupidly ignorant people there are who don't understand or appreciate this tribute to Sagan. And they'll all be first to tell you you're wrong and never take criticism themselves. You should take Whet out--it'll clean it up and at least get rid of the stupid comments regarding that subject and let them get on to more important issues.
There were NO wars caused by lack of religion--quite the opposite. And to all you complete IDIOTS who think atheists are bad because they don't believe in a Hell to punish them....well, I know a lot of really stupid christians (not all, i know, so save your bitching) who think that the only way to heaven is to accept Jesus. Even horribly awful rotten people can get in!! They just have to accept Jesus. That's something to believe in?
I'm sorry, but one more point. Some of you *ssh*l*e christians are downvoting this site......but what's Carl
Sagan's message? "... it underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, and to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've ever known." Would your "Jesus" disagree with that? DEAL MORE KINDLY WITH ONE ANOTHER? You people are hypocrites. GOD DAMN HYPOCRITES.
At times we're forced to put our most conceivably brutal thoughts into words. Observing ourselves as what we obviously are is probably the most sacrilegious way of being. Followers of religion (except buddhism) believe that their only purpose on this little blue dot is to prove which afterlife they deserve. My only purpose on this little blue dot is to help find a bigger blue dot.
then you missed the entire point of what Sagan was trying to say ...even your hatred is meaningless compared to the vastness of the universe and I don't think that was 's intention, to inspire new found hatred for those that see things differently from us...I'm a Christian and I can still appreciate the message
then you missed the entire point of what Sagan was trying to say WAchu...even
your hatred is meaningless compared to the vastness of the universe and I
don't think that was Lave's intention, to inspire new found hatred for those
that see things differently from us...I'm a Christian and I can still
appreciate the message.....................sorry for the first comment....it looked like I was suggesting Lave was wrong
Here's a joke ive always wanted to say, but never found the right place too. I think it also can tie into this YTMND alot. A-hem....This atheist and agnostic are having a conversation. The atheist says "I don't believe in God" The agnostic turns to him and says "Oh yeah, prove it." We look so long for proof of things one way or the other and what it always boils down to is THOUGHT. Which is just as perpetually impossible to prove as truth.
A christian once called me closed-minded because i didn't agree with his beliefs. lol. Anyway, 5 for bringing light to a new point of view, I had never heard of that. I'm tired of people calling each other close-minded when they are just as close-minded as anyone else. if you don't agree with someone's beliefs, apparently that makes you close-minded! I don't get insulted by being close-minded, I get insulted when someone tries to insult me by calling me that, because that insults my intelligence.
Wow, just so many comments since I last checked. I just feel it necessary to point out the horror of this. Few people seem to realize how truly terrible Sagan's words were. "In our obscurity, in all this vastness, there is no hint that help will come from elsewhere to save us from ourselves." This was meant as a warning. Far too many people ignore what's going on with our world, the mass extinction of species, global warming, nuclear and biological warfare, thinking that if a catastrophe should happen...
... that mankind can still establish itself on another world, or adapt, or that some religious figurehead or aliens will save us all. The truth is, once we screw this up, we're all done. Like he said, we're all alone out here, and the Earth is where we make our stand. We act as if global threats like those I enumerated will never happen, or that we'll find some miracle solution when it does happen. But we won't. If we let it happen, mankind will sink into oblivion, dragging the rest of the world with it.
I think what atheists are trying to say is that man is always trying to find significance but this picture illustrates that we are not special in the universe. We are just a fixture in nature that will act out its role and then decay like all matter in this world. The faster we realize that the faster we stop fighting each other about who has the best imaginary friend. . .Screw that, I want to hear the Christian sermon. . . I want to live forever and ever!!!
"atheists and agnostics are morally superior to religious
nuts, because we act good to others without having to be threatened with
torture and hellfire."
if you were "morally superior" wouln't you just let it go and let people do what they want to?
the whole point of this was to show that we are all here on this planet to work together and not care about another's beleifs. let's stop fighting and let's not destroy this one earth that we have by stupid violence and war over something as simple as religion.
So many words... So little said.
"Small-minded" are the faithful? Remorseless, unsupported jabs put you on the same level you set your opponents.
Despite your lack of a point or successful argument, this is a welcome perspective. Nothing like astronomy to humble us, and Lord knows we need it. What better way to mess with Mankind than to make him at once great and at once insignificant?
Atheism is just as bullsh*t as religion (take from that what you will; whether you're offended by that statement or not is your choice, as it's just a comparison). There are too many unknowns in the universe to make any finite decisions in this regard. Any atheist that touts his/her self as a logical being is obviously ignoring this simple fact.
That said, the quotation from Carl Sagan is truly inspirational irregardless of your theistic beliefs. We all share this planet. Learn to live with each other.
So many stupid people reading this YTMND entirely wrong!
This is not an argument against religion, nor is it bashing whetstone. It is simply illustrating the futility of arguing over such matters as race, religion and such. Because compared to the complete VASTNESS of our infinite universe, we are NOTHING. Worthless to the cosmic winds. And NOT A SINGLE intelligent race has a single incentive to save us. If trends continue, and we never raise ourselves from this generation "me" crap, we are doomed to die.
More simpletons should view this enlightening YTMND & see that the universe is simply too ginormous for God to exist. Even an omnipotent, "all-powerful" God would simply be too spent after creating Earth to bother with the rest of the Universe. This new perspective demonstrates that the Earth is as relatively insignificant in the cosmic scheme as an atom inside my body, or a bomb. Value is tied to perspective and scope. After all, the larger the Universe, the less important are its individual components!
Thank you for opening my eyes! Even an omniscient, "all-knowing" God couldn't possibly see or care about ALL THAT Universe! And the idea that God should approve of, much less encourage, exploration and study, the pursuit of knowledge of His creation, aka "science:" ludicrous! Why can't more small-minded religious expand their consciousness & learn to project their own limitations and insecurities upon the image of God as you do? Atheists know that God was made in man's image, and not the other way around...
The picture speaks volumes, I'd dare say more than most others.
The words ring so true, and evoke a myriad of emotions, the fact that we are so very alone on our relatively frail little planet is no comforting thought, though at the same time we are so indefinitely lucky to be here at all.
Well done, I thought the music was well paced and fitted well, the Voyager sounds added that little extra spice to make it a truly delicious site.
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